RaysUp - Last in AL East - Catching up behind the plate

Early in season at bottom of AL East

• Baltimore Orioles & Cincinnati Reds – O’s lose 24 to 2
• Not Charlie Morton’s Day 
• Wrexham A.F.C. comparison
• Max Fried is bringing the fire – almost No-Hitter
• Catchers & Pitcher Battery
• Catcher value measurements
  • Arm Strength
  • Pop Time – Caught Stealing
  • Blocking
  • Framing
  • Pitcher not shaking off calls from catcher, Yanier Molina 
  • Fangraphs – effective defensive rating
• Danny Jansen, 1st year with Rays, great blocker & building rapport with pitchers
• Rays not catching opponents from stealing bases
• Importance of Framing metric decreases with electronic strike zone
• Salvador Perez – Kansas City Royals catcher
• Tres Barrera & Logan Driscoll
• Baseball Savant measure catcher framing & strike zone
• Rays catchers rank 50th & 51st
• Why is Jonathan Aranda not showing up higher in the lineup
• Taylor Walls, switch hitting talent questioned
• Rays Roster Crunch – Palacios, Montes, Caballero, Josh Lowe, Tre Moran
• Trade Brandon Lowe to Mariners for Harry Ford
• Tre Morgan
• Moving on from Randy Arozarena, they moved on from Zach Effinrrrrrr
• Moving a franchise player like Brandon Lowe, Kevin Kiermaier & Longoria
• Evan Longoria could bring a strong aggressive approach as a coach for the team
• The question to Eric Neander and his group “Who is our core”
• Sign Junior Caminero to a long-term extension
• Fast Bat Speed – 78.7 mph – bat speed – Junior Caminero exceeds Judge & Ohtani
• Move Yandy Diaz to Reds who need a first baseman since Joey Votto left
• Rays have an outstanding outfield core throughout all of the Rays organization
• What’s happening with Curtis Mead
• NHL playoffs
• Stanley Cup – at which point do that stop adding winning team tiers
• Tampa Championships
• Tampa Baseball Museum event with Larry Rothschild, Joe Maddon & Rick Vaughn
• Rays this year looks like Astros of last year, who started slow and grew stronger
• Will the away games strengthen the team
• Smelling the frustration of Kevin Cash
• Rays have the talent and potential to, to fight back
• Charleston River Dogs are one of the hottest minor league team

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Special Thanks to XTaKe-R-U-X for the music Rocking Forward, 

Transcript

290 BaseballBiz On Deck - Catching & Chandler Simpson RaysUP

Mark Corbett: [00:00:00] Man, and there it is. 

Mat Germain: The question is, are we allowed to be happy as Rays fans right now? 

Mark Corbett: Oh gosh, I don't know. Welcome to Baseball Biz on Deck. That's Mat Germain. I'm Mark Corbett. And as Rays fans, boy it is not the best of times. The best of times, the worst of times. This is like maybe. If you're being kind the most lukewarm of times, I guess, and that's being gentle because we're in the basement on the Al East.

Man, it hurts. I mean, I was looking across all of MLB and see who was, uh, some of those that are beneath us as far as win losses. Uh, the White Sox, woo. The, the twins, who else? My gosh. It was, it was, it's sad though. It was just a bad look all the way around when you're looking. As far as the win loss right now.

See the, um, the Rockies, oh my gosh, they're four and 18. Mat. Good gravy. [00:01:00] You know I'm, geez. So there we are. We've got, uh, the winning percentage as of right now, and it's Wednesday around eight o'clock, 3 91. That's nine wins, 14 losses. So boys and girls, this, this is, this is not the team I thought was coming.

Mat Germain: I wouldn't say that. So the, I, what I would say is I've been encouraged with how much they're in the games generally. There's only a few that I would say, you know, they played terribly and they were never in it sort of thing. Um, so overall, I mean, uh, you know, without Shane McClannahan there, without Ha-Seong Kim, uh, there's excuses you can make.

Like, and, and I think of, you know, you'll bring it up later, but the bottom of the Rays lineup has let them down generally. Yeah. The vast majority of this season, and it continues to be as if the rays believe for some reason, that having a double NL team, so two guys at the bottom of the lineup [00:02:00] that just can't hit is okay.

They think that's okay, and they think they can get by with that because their defense is so stellar, which we know isn't the case for one of them. Yeah. Um. Yeah, you, we will go deeper into that. 

Mark Corbett: Yeah. Yeah. I tell you, well let, let's stay out for just a little bit here in the AL East, because I did want to talk about that game with the Cincinnati Reds.

I love watching Elly De La Cruz and I. He, in this particular game, he made an impact, but not as much as everybody else. They were playing Baltimore, playing the Orioles in Baltimore and nine inning game 24 to two. Uh, we were talking about a big run differential we had about a week ago. And it, it ain't nothing compared to this.

It's like, oh my gosh, I can, I can only wonder about that. But, but they wanted to make sure they took care of that weekend and gave something to the Orioles fans. I don't know if it is that day or the next. They had a, a [00:03:00] giveaway. 15,000 bobbleheads of the owner of the team. Oh my gosh. Are we talking about being blind about what your fan base enjoys?

I saw a few of 'em getting kicked around and I looked on eBay and they're not really selling as much as, uh, old saying, uh, a Alex Rutschman or Cedric Mullin's. Bobblehead might, 

Mat Germain: yeah. , owners shouldn't be that much in this spotlight, should they? Like, I get, you know. Okay. Let, let's use Wrexham A.F.C, a FC in, in soccer, right?

Yeah. They have, uh, Ryan Reynolds and Rob McElhanney. That that's a completely different, , story. If you're, if Tom Brady, I think he owns Birmingham as well in that same league, that's a totally different story. They, they're just, they're, they're Hollywood or they're mega stars. But if your owner is, you know Robert Kraft Yeah.

You should know who he is. Yeah. But do you need a bobblehead of Robert Kraft? No. [00:04:00] You know, do you need Jerry Jones on a bobblehead? No. No. So it just, it's too much like promote your players, be selfless and, and you know, you're already taking in the loot. I. Promote everybody else. 

Mark Corbett: Uh, it just shows their detachment.

Man, I tell you what, it's, it's, it's a shame. I mean, there's things that, uh, he's doing right now, spending a little bit more, but not enough's happening there, and that, that game, that differential and sadness. Looking at a former Ray man, seeing Charlie Morton, he's up here, what, uh, two and one thirds innings.

He's got seven hits, seven earned runs. Four walks, two strikeouts, and it was not Charlie's day. He. 

Mat Germain: Like, I'm gonna ask you something about Charlie. Like I, having seen him with the Rays and the Braves, he is a very, very, very family oriented man. 

Mark Corbett: Mm-hmm. And, 

Mat Germain: and I have a feeling that the whole detachment, and I don't know what their situation is on who's living where, [00:05:00] but when he was in Tampa, he made it seem like that was a priority because his family was gonna stay in Tampa.

Mark Corbett: Yeah. 

Mat Germain: So Atlanta was tolerable because it was still within vicinity. How much of that is playing into his mental state of mind right now? You know? And, and would a change of scenery be worthwhile for him? I know they're gonna try the pen thing and I've said the Rays should, if they ever make it into the playoffs.

Yeah. He would be a great guy, you know, in the back end of your pen because he just handles that pressure and he could add a few ticks on, on the, uh, on the fastball, uh, with his curve. Oh man, are you kidding me? So. I just feel bad for him and I feel bad for the whole situation. So I wonder if that plays on him.

Mark Corbett: It, it could very well, I forgot, like you were saying about how much he, he was about family and about, you know, how he was looking at Tampa was going to be his home,, looking at another pitcher that we faced this past week and that was Max Fried. Here's another pitcher. You know, I talked to you before, like when we faced Nate [00:06:00] Eovaldi.

I'm always excited to see him, uh, was Max Fried. I'm always excited to see him, see him, and we almost gave him, what, a seven inning, no hitter. Uh, the, the guy who was keeping, I guess, official score turned an error into a hit on him, but, uh. I 

Mat Germain: think it's ironic that the, uh, the youngest and, and or least experienced Ray is the one that got to him first.

They ended up changing the scoring on it, but, uh, you know, max Fried, I think I've, I was wrong in the off season. I, I said, you know, there might be a letdown, you know, there's no letdown. He's been all fire and, uh, he's handling it very well. So, so far he's the Rays and, and he is behaving like an ace. 

Mark Corbett: One of the things I wanted to talk about today is catching, and we'll talk about, about with the Rays, but kind of taking a, a global look for folks too, because it's.

Much like when we talked about pitchers in the past and saying the wins what a win [00:07:00] is. Well, a win can be, you can do great and practically have no scores against you, but your, your, uh, offense is not put up anything and you actually lose, even though it was a great performance. One of the best performances say that your pitcher gave that year, and so the battery, that the battery being the pitcher and the catcher.

That is where so much of that action goes. And catchers, catchers, there's a few things we look for and that's one of the things I wanted to, to uh, kinda go over with you today. I know one of them is looking at arm strength. Uh, one of 'em is pop time, which is always interesting to see how quickly they can snap up that ball when he comes back to him as a catcher gets it and has to get it over maybe to second and get somebody out.

I mean, those are some of the key elements. What they have to, you know, to execute. Uh, let's see, what else do I have on here? But, oh, yeah, blocking, being able to make sure that the ball's not, you know, wild pitch [00:08:00] or, , a pass. And then of course you've got framing and those are some of the elements that a catcher's gonna have to contend with.

But I don't know if framing is gonna be as important. In the future as we get more and more electronic valuations of what's going to be a strike or not. The one, and maybe you could see more depth on this, Mat, when I'm looking for some of the pieces that I don't think are measured and I don't know that it can be, is the guidance that a catcher gives.

Their pitcher, being able to give them instruction on the best pitch they need to give for the batter who's at the plate right now. To me, I haven't seen a metric per se that evaluates that. Is there a way you see it as a scout? 

Mat Germain: No. No. There's no way that, and honestly, this is why you, you almost [00:09:00] need, um. A, the collection of pitchers that are on that team to rate the catcher's performance on that front in order to get an accurate reading.

They're the only ones that can really, and maybe the manager or whoever is setting up the game plan, the pitching coach, because they'll know what impact. So if you ask Kyle Snyder, you know who he wants, catching who and why, he'll tell you exactly what the performance of each catcher is and what they're better matched with based on how they're handling their situation.

So I think. You, you know, sometimes, sometimes you can see a guy like Yanier, Molina and how he's handling the pitchers and then when he goes to the mound and how he's talking to them and the fact that there's no shaking off right. So he puts the fingers down and they're, yes, I know that's what I gotta throw.

So that's a big sign. So that's the one thing you can monitor from, from home. And say, okay, well how often is this catcher shaking, uh, being shaken off by the pitcher? Uh, we, with [00:10:00] the way that they have technology now, we don't see as much of that because it is sometimes geared from the pitcher assigning the pitch to the catcher.

Uh, and you know, so there's a little bit lost there. Um, but. I think generally speaking, uh, Fangraphs does a decent job of rating the best, , catchers with their defensive rating. And, and they include, you know, things like, uh, defensive red and saved the framing, the arm, uh, the stone base factor. Mm-hmm. The blocked, uh, you know, they, so they compile all, all of that and they come up with a defensive rating.

And so when you see guys like Austin Hedges Con consistently in the top, you know, five to 10, uh, Austin Wells, Gabrielle Moreno. Guys like that. Like they're, they're automatics. So when you see their rating reflect that, you're like, yeah, okay, that makes a lot of sense. So that's what I would say is when you're looking at catching statistics, ask yourself, when you sit back and look at the ranking and say, does that make sense?

Or are there [00:11:00] outliers that just make this an outlandish statistic that I shouldn't put as, as much weight on. Uh, so that's how I would term it. 

Mark Corbett: , and one of the things I'm always looking forward to is that pop time and seeing, you know, how many times that they've, uh, caught somebody stealing. And I know when we had Wilson Ramos had a strong arm man.

Yep. I don't think many people got past him. 

Mat Germain: No. And, Mike Zunino was probably just as good. Like Mike Zunino had a cannon, and I think he was underrated for that. That's the guy that the Rays had that handled the staff extremely well. He was heavily invested, and I know Danny Jansen's getting to know the staff.

He'll never have a canon of an arm, but he's a great blocker. He's, he's somebody that will actually lead the staff very well. He is well liked. He has a rapport that he builds with pitchers. It just takes time to get to know them. Right. And the Rays starters, to be quite honest, have done fairly well. [00:12:00] So on the, on the, um, on the pitch calling relationship side of things the Rays catchers have done.

Okay. Um, I don't think I would call them elite, uh, from what I've seen, the interesting part of it is, how much weight do you put on the rest of it? On the hitting, on the blocking on the, the, the caught stealings? I mean, the rays are basically handing bases to opponents right now.

Like, there's nobody being caught. Nobody even really close to being caught. Yeah. So, so you know, if you're gonna have that kind of running game go up against you all the time, it puts a lot of pressure on a defense. Uh, and the pitcher is really to get a lot of double plays and, and, and things like that.

So, I. I don't know. The, the Rays catching situation and catching in general in the league, you're right, is gonna change because of that whole, you know, uh, strike calling system that's gonna get put in, in some way, shape, or form. Um, and I think the more there'll be a more emphasis on the [00:13:00] bat and the throwing because of that.

Mark Corbett: Well, it is, it is entertaining and exciting to see some great catchers. I know. One of mine favorites is, uh, Sally Salvador Perez, man, watching him with the Royals one because he's been there, was he, I think almost like he's probably 34, 35 years old now. And to watch him one, just to see a big man behind there, you know, is, and being able to do what he does and being really, you know, pretty dig on good at, at the plate too.

I don't have his average in front of me, but I. That that's something too. I mean, you can have somebody who does a great job behind that plate. Sometimes I think just like we have a DHS for our pitchers, that we should have DHS for our catchers because they have a such a select talent that they're able to use there that it doesn't necessarily always, uh, roll over into good offense.

Mat Germain: Don't tell Rob Manfred that because you know, he is gonna, he is [00:14:00] gonna test the waters with it if you tell him, oh Lord. 

Mark Corbett: Yeah. You never should have sent him that letter about the golden bat. I'm sorry that you should never have sent that. 

Mat Germain: Yeah. The, the, the Royals have a, have another young catcher called Freddy Furman, and I know I've, I've kind of pondered whether or not the Rays might be able Tory him from, from the royals, but he's an up and coming guy.

That would be a, a little bit of a boost. 

Mark Corbett: Well, not taking any away from Ward Fed or Jansen. I mean, sounds like Jansen, you know, still got some time to come up. I, I was actually a little surprised to see Rortvedt was still with us. I thought they would've found somebody else. , but no. And so what does that mean is from our farm system, you seeing anybody in the farm system coming up that might make a difference?

Mat Germain: So the Ray signed Tres Barrera, and, and he's a, he's a very intriguing guy, like the, just the power coming off his back. He's 30 years old. He's not a prospect. He's, he's basically an established guy that that's lingered around. And he's been on really [00:15:00] good teams. He's been with the Cardinals, he's been with teams that actually develop really good catchers.

He just hasn't been exploded yet, uh, to the point where he would stay on the staff for that long, in my opinion. He's a clear upgrade over Ben Rortveldt. . At the plate. I have no idea what his presence behind the plate is like and what his rapport is with pitchers and, and what his work ethic is on that. , but I will say that his badge just looks really intriguing and, and aaa, and he's had some games where, it's not just.

Get it over the fence power. It's, it's pretty significant power. And that's something that the Rays need. Um, I know Ben's shown glimpses of that, you know, last year here and there, but it was very sporadic and, and nothing consistent. Whereas Tres Barrera would provide that co consistently, in my opinion. So he's one guy to look at Logan Driscoll's on the IL right now in Triple A.

He's a guy. I know the Rays really like. If there's a chance that they're waiting for him to come back and then they'll call him up, [00:16:00] you know, because they were really happy with the way that he was handling the staff last year, at the end of the year. And so his bat is also intriguing. And because the left-handed bat, he partners well with Danny Jansen.

So, you know, maybe they're waiting for that instead. But in my opinion, Ben Rortveldt days are getting pretty short, uh, because of, of the lackluster offense, which is, is flatlining, to be honest. And, and it's to the point where the rays have to start looking at making some moves. If they're gonna keep up with the other teams in the AL East, 

Mark Corbett: Well, we will see, but I'm, I am curious to see what hap and I can't speak, I'm curious to see what does happen there. Man, it looks like there's definitely room for improvement and I would look forward to seeing, Mr. Jansen get a little better and a little bit more acquainted with the team as well.

I just wanna 

Mat Germain: add something to that. Mm-hmm. Uh, if I could, 'cause I know not everybody's used to, um, to navigating [00:17:00] baseball savant, but if you go in baseball savant and you look at the leaderboard and you go to Catcher Framing, and then you select the strike rate, okay. And I think that's a very important.

You know, aspect of of, of a catcher, how many strikes are they actually getting when they're there? And if you look at that list of, of pitchers and, or sorry, catchers and their ranking, it'll almost mimic exactly the ranking that you'll see in defensive rating of FanGraphs. So it's very interesting how they marry each other quite a bit.

So you could take the top 15, more than likely the top 15 are the same on FanGraphs defensive rating. So when you see both Rays catching options ranked 50th and 51st out of qualified catchers, you get concerned, right? Because that, to me, the, that's the point where when I look at some of the woes of the pen, the Rays pen in particular, uh.

I think that's where it lies. It, it lies in the fact that [00:18:00] neither of the catchers are doing a great job framing or getting strikes, in which case it's adding pressure on those guys to be perfect and, and throwing the ball where they probably shouldn't and on occasion. And, um, and, and it leads to mistakes being amplified, so.

Uh, that's why I think there needs to be a change. I, I have faith that Jansen will improve on that. Not so much that Ben can actually get back to the top, you know, like he did last year. So, with the bat being what it is, I think it's that that's one way that another resource that you can look at. If you're looking for catching, um, depth.

Mark Corbett: Help me out here. There is a metric, and I don't know if it's specific to catching or not, WRC weighted. Runs created. Runs created, 

Mat Germain: yeah. 

Mark Corbett: And is that one of the, the factors that they would be using, 

in evaluating a catcher's, uh, strength? 

Mat Germain: No. Only they're hitting. So we runs, created where is, is the offensive?

Everything combined. [00:19:00] How much impact do they have on the game offensively? Gotcha. Essentially you're, so I put out a tweet today, actually, coincidentally, the, the top two in major league baseball when it comes to the way that runs created, um, are Aaron Judge. No surprise, everybody would believe that.

Second is Jonathan Aranda. 

Mark Corbett: Woo hoo. Yeah. 

Mat Germain: , this is part of why, I know we're gonna talk about this anyway, but why is he not hitting second? Or third at most, right? Like, why is Brandon Lowe still second? I, I don't understand the, the, the concept, I, i know the history, but Brandon Lowe's never been an average hitter.

Never, ever, ever, ever. He's never belonged in the two hole. So to me, the, the rays are making continuous mistakes in how they set up their lineup, and it's frustrating. I get that there's. There's never a perfect formula, to be honest. Every manager must go through a hundred [00:20:00] different equations when they're setting up the lineup, and they'll, there'll always be people that detract, but to me, the hottest hitter that is producing, you know, consistently through the year should be hitting second.

Yeah. You know, or first if you want, like Shohei Ohtani hits first for the Dodgers. Right. Um. But if you're not doing that, all you're doing is taking at bats away from your best hitter. Mm-hmm. And drawing them to a hitter that's not producing as much. Why is that? You know, thought of as good. I don't understand it.

Jonathan Aranda should be first or second in a Rays lineup consistently on until he cools off, in my opinion. 

Mark Corbett: Well, you know, we talked about the MS last week and how they were doing so fantastic. Mm-hmm. And, um. Two of those guys are in the outfield, I think the other night, and that's, uh, Mangum and Meisner now.

And who was in Centerfield? New guy, Chandler Simpson. Woof, man. He was making it look good out there. What 

Mat Germain: are, [00:21:00] what are your thoughts on him initially? Overall, 

Mark Corbett: I'm excited about him. He's, he shows the verve, he shows the power, he shows he's the, the speed, uh, he brings an excitement to the game again, you know, I'm trying to think of who that player was.

We got. Toward the end of the 2020 season, but somebody who's gonna be still in bases like nobody's business, uh, I, I'm seeing him to adding a whole other level of entertainment as well as, you know, bringing something strong for the team. So I'm ex, I'm real excited to see him there, but that, what I go back to Mat is, and you mentioned this before, what are we gonna do with De Luca and Josh Lowe when they come back?

I mean, I'm looking at those three spots out there right now, and. I guess you could even put, uh, put Morel out there and mix him up too if you were going to Yeah. Well, I'll, I'll stop mo we, we'll talk, take a look at what the fields should look like, because I know with Junior at third [00:22:00] you could put him also, I would imagine, uh, short stop.

But you're gonna have Kim coming back. So Taylor, uh, I'm still surprised he's with us. I wish him the best. But, uh, I'll look at that shortstop position and I just shake my head. There's, there's, so I, 

Mat Germain: I took a deep look at Taylor Walls and, and I still don't understand. Okay, so switch hitting is something that you do when there's a benefit to it.

Yeah. Right. So we have, what, four or five years now of Taylor Walls and Major League Baseball has never had any success switch hitting. So what should the thought process be? Why are we continuing to do it? He hits worse than pitchers did in when a national league was still allowing pitchers to hit against right-handed hitters as a left-handed batter.

So why not just make him a right-handed hitter and see how it goes? Yeah, stop [00:23:00] the madness. Like I, I really don't understand the thought process. If it hasn't worked by now and he's 28 years old, stop. Letting him switch hit. It does not work. Move on. Try something new. Like I don't understand the, the, the, I understand the persistence of playing him because of how he plays shortstop.

That's fine. But like the, the Jays didn't hang on to John Mc McDonald and signed him to million dollar Deals because he could play a, because he could hit, they, you know, they didn't give him all that playing time. He was a guy off the bench that might pop into a game every third or fourth game, right?

The rays are playing Taylor walls consistently and it's dragging their off offense down big time. Put 'em in, leave him right-handed. Tell him to get used to hitting left hand or right-handed pitchers from the right side. That's what Jose Caballero does. He doesn't have any issues with it, so why not try it with Taylor?

You know, he might actually benefit [00:24:00] from it and, and I, I think the rays right now have a roster crunch. I think that's what we're talking about, right? 

Mark Corbett: Mm-hmm. I mean, 'cause you got Palacios and Caballero and you know you've got them, you talk about Trey Morgan coming and, uh, ma Coco, my gosh, dude, uh, I'm looking there.

I mean, Aranda, he's perfect at first. There's no reason to bring Yandy back after for that Yandy B the DH. Go ahead. So 

Mat Germain: the, the around a bit, I think, you know, because the defense is not only just better at first, it's also better at second. 

Mark Corbett: Yeah. 

Mat Germain: So my train of of thought is you have a team like the Mariners looking for offense.

Brandon Lowe would add a lot of offense to the Mariners. Mm-hmm. So. Could he be a trade piece so that the rays go out and get a catcher like Harry Ford? Right now, the the Mariners signed Cal Rally to a long-term deal. They're committed to him. Harry Ford needs a home. Go out and get him. Send Brendan Lowe in a prospect.

That, that the Mariners will [00:25:00] want because they'll want the years added on. Right. And then bring Harry Ford back. The, the question is gonna be, will the Rays eat the money? 'cause the Mariners are one of the few, you know, franchises out there that claim poor even though they're not. I. And so the rays will probably have to send some money as well as Brendan Lowe and, and they love Brendan Lowe, but to me that just makes complete sense because then what you have is the open hole for Trey Morgan to come up.

And like Chandler Simpson, he puts the bat to the ball. He is the best hitter on his team consistently at every level. He's played, including triple AAA so far. He hits over three 20 at every level. The guy is ready to hit at the major league level. There's nothing really for him to know, and he's the best defensive first baseman in all of the minors.

You do not, you know, hold that back if it's sitting there in aaa and the Rays would save some money on top of it. And I think we all know that the Rays, you know. They have, they started that growth [00:26:00] path last year at the trade deadline. When they moved on from Randy, they moved on from Zach Eflin. They moved on from a bunch of guys.

They basically committed to somewhat of a makeover. Now they tried to go the half, okay, we're competing, but we're, but to me, you only commit to that this year. If Brendan Lowe is showing signs that he's going to be an elite player. He's not showing that at a no. He'll be okay. He's going give you some power here and there, but he is not a necessity when you have Jonathan Aranda out doing him double.

Yeah. 

Mark Corbett: Uh, goodness. Case. You know, I, you know, it's you and I've been talking about Taylor Walls for a while, so I, I'm not, I'm still surprised he's there and I wish him well and I'm gonna try to sing bad, but. You know, these we're looking at top talent, but you and I also talked about how long we would keep Kiermaier and you know.

Mm-hmm. Hey, I love it that Kevin got himself a ring buddy. You know, he left us, he goes up to your part of the world up there in the, [00:27:00] the other side of the border, and then next thing you know, he is finishing up the year with the Dodgers and gets his World Series ring. Yep. But I don't 

Mat Germain: mind that at all.

That's great. 

Mark Corbett: Oh, and, and I think, you know, Brandon, Brandon could find something really good. I mean, Longoria found some really good things over the years. I mean, Brandon is probably the closest thing we have to a franchise player, I guess, at the moment. And, but I can't buy into those anymore. I, because I just, 'cause I know the ray's not gonna do it.

Um, like you were talking about before, bringing Longo back is a, um. Inside the office and, you know, I gotta tell you, uh, kind of the hubbub around here, Tampa, and I've been in some different baseball situations with different groups of people. I'm hearing a hum about that, you know, about that becoming a reality.

So yeah, I'm, I'm looking forward to, I hope that happens. You need it. Yep. You, I think 

Mat Germain: Kevin Cash would behave a lot differently, especially with lineup build and, and the focus on offense. He just doesn't have that. Uh, [00:28:00] that, what would you call it? I don't even know what the term would be. Uh, that aggression, I guess.

Mm-hmm. With making guys feel uncomfortable with where he is putting them in the lineup because they're not, you know, they're not doing the job or, or they need to make a change. But I think the, um. What this all leads to really is you have to sit back, right? You're Eric Neander and and his group, I think he has four assistant GMs and you have to sit there and say, okay, who is our core?

Right. So to me, if you move on from Brandon Lowe, how you shift the conversation away from, oh, we've just traded another franchise player is one. He has major back issues that can pop up at any point in time. Yeah, he could be out the rest of the season. It was career, almost career ending. Right. Two, we're sitting in the basement, we have to make a change.

Three, we have Jonathan Aranda, who's just tearing the cover off the ball. He needs more playing time. We wanna stick him in that second and, four. You [00:29:00] sign junior camp and narrow to a long-term extension. That's the, that's the formula. 

Mark Corbett: That's the letter of the week Caminero, man. Because he is it, oh gosh.

He is it, he, he's, uh, definitely going to be a game changer throughout the entire season. Uh, if you look at him, what was it, uh, prior to the start of even spring training, I think. Was he down in Mexico or is the Dominican Republic? He was playing and had that walk off. Home run and that bat flip that goes up to about 40 feet in the air and the he, he brings energy.

We were talking about Simpson a moment ago, but Caminero does the same and Wow. 

Mat Germain: So I wanna go through, so when you think of the best hitters in Major League baseball, right? What they have in common is fast bat speed. Mm-hmm. Okay. So you have at uh, the seventh best. Bad speed this year is Aaron Judge. 76.5 miles per hour.

Okay. When we're [00:30:00] looking, Shohei Ohtani, he's, I know he started a little bit late. He had some issues. Uh, 76.8 miles per hour. He's sitting in fifth. Sitting at number four is Jordan and Alvarez, 76.8 miles per hour. Okay. Who's at the top of the list? Junior ca at 78.7. Yes. I'm telling you, Meck. It might not be this year.

It might not be next year, but at some point that kid is going to explode when he gets his mature. Outlook on how a a plate appearance should be, and, and it's just going to be insanely expensive to sign him at that point. So the rays have to get ahead of the curb, use some of the money that they save from trading guys like y di uh, Yandy Diaz and um, Brendan Lowe, and, and just move on.

Like bring up Tree Morgan. Bring up, uh. You know, younger guys that you can actually build around. Yeah. Start getting that core to learn and build [00:31:00] together. Um, and, and you'll be fine. You have Danny Jansen there who can guide and, and be like the, the more veteran voice you have Ha-Seong Kim that's gonna come in and also have a presence that has, you know, a lot of experience.

So even if you trade Yandy Diaz, which I think, you know, the Reds are intriguing. The Reds, you know, lost Joey Votto. They never really replaced them very well. I think Terry Fona wants a new lead off hitter. They need a little bit of offense from first base. That's an option. If you send Brandon Lowe, then to the Mariners, you bring in some guys like Terry Ford who can pop right into your catching position, learn from Jansen.

Boom. Now you've got that kind of, you know. Future, six, seven years of, of a group that you can have building together and you still have Dominic Keegan down in aaa, you have Logan Driscoll down in aa, you have the, the outstanding outfield core that's coming up behind them. Like it's really impressive the guys that they have at every level that'll be popping into the L field [00:32:00] and putting pressure on the guys that are there right now.

So. I, I think I'm just, I know it's early, like big moves like that don't generally happen often in April and May, but with the Rays current situation, like I would say if they, if they don't have, uh, more than a, a four and six record over the next 10, yeah, I would definitely start looking at that. If I'm the Rays.

Yeah, and their schedule is tough. Mark, look at the Rays schedule right now. Like, I don't know who made this schedule and I don't know why. It seems to me like every time they turn around, they're gonna be playing somebody that you expect to be contending. But, but it's, it's kind of baffling how, how their, how tough their schedule is.

Mark Corbett: We'll see how they play it out. I mean, they've had, was it like the 13 game home, um, home stand and now they're out and on the other side of the continent, and we'll see how that continues. But Jason, he, I, I just don't know, man, I the, the [00:33:00] flexibility. That, that rays do have because of all of that talent that's coming up in the farm system.

And, and I do like your idea on the ability of, of doing some trades. I mean, yes, I think Diaz and I think Brandon both could be, uh, people that move on. We've, we've got youth, we've got strength with other players there. And so yeah. You hate to say goodbye to anybody, but uh, uh, I could see that's something we need to do.

Mat Germain: The other guy I wanna mention just quickly is Curtis Mead. I have no idea what to do with Curtis Mead. I really don't. I, I'm, I'm at a loss. I thought this spring he had shown, you know, glimpses of something that could be, and I don't know if he's frustrated because it didn't click right away when the season started, but he just looks completely lost and, and sometimes you need just that one spark to get yourself going.

So I, I just don't know how many chances he's gonna get before the Ray is actually calling someone else to. To pop in there. [00:34:00] 

Mark Corbett: Well, let's hope he can bring it together. Just 'cause I, yeah, I know. He seemed like he had a lot of spirit early on and we all had a lot of hope for Curtis and seeing that young Australian come, well, not so young, yes.

Anymore. But, uh, from my perspective, everybody's young and I, I didn't realize, I'm actually older than, uh, Francona. So Terry Francona. Really? Yeah. He retired and came back. So, you know, I've been. It's kinda doing the same anyway. Oh, brother. Well, that's, that's the bulk of what I had on my list, uh, to talk about today.

You got any goodies? I mean, are there any other sports or anything going on in the world? 

Mat Germain: Watching the playoffs for, for hockey. And my, my team's the have, so it's been a while since they've been in the playoffs and they have a really young team. They weren't, I think at some point in January they were given a 2% chance of making the playoffs.

And then they actually, you know, did well enough that they got in. They brought in a Russian guy called, uh, Dedo, who's just, you know, a little. I would [00:35:00] say a little very raw. I think it's his fourth game tonight that he's playing. And it's the second that's playoffs. So it gives you an idea. It's sort of like how the Rays brought in Shane McClannahan right into the playoffs.

Right? Yep. Um, so yeah, it's, it's fun to watch them in the playoffs 'cause it's always a different atmosphere. But they're learning. They're learning, you know, what you can and can't do. How physical it gets in the playoffs. 'cause everything becomes. Uh, a game of possession and finishing your hits and getting that extra, , little elbow rub under the chin and, and slash across the back of the knee and all the little chippy stuff that happens.

So it's great to see them and, and the passion that, uh. That Montreal has for hockey definitely comes out even more in the playoffs. So I'm curious to see how they'll, uh, react at home. Uh, right now I think they're losing two one to the capitals tonight. Uh, they lost the last game in overtime, but they were down two, nothing.

They ended up coming back and tying it and which for them is, is a [00:36:00] huge feat considering how tentative they looked in the first half. Wow. But, uh, yeah, hockey is great for playoffs, man. Like, that's one sport that when you get into playoffs, it's intense the whole way through. And, and to be honest, like they hand out the, the, the Stanley Cup at the end of, uh, well, sometime in June, usually first week of June, maybe second, depending on scheduling.

And then the guys have to start their training camps in August so that that off season is extremely short for teams that win the Stanley Cup. So that's why you rarely see any repeats. 'cause the, the team's usually burnt out and then their legs just fail them the next season at some point after Christmas.

So, uh, yeah, it's fun. It's fun to watch and I love the trophy. Like the Stanley Cup has everybody's name on it that's won the Stanley Cup. So what I would ask is, at what point do they stop adding tears? 'cause they're not gonna be able to carry that thing on the crazy, but at [00:37:00] some point they're gonna have to say, okay, this is it.

This is the last level, this is the last team that wins it. There'll be a huge celebration and they'll have the Stanley Cup too, I guess. Oh my gosh. 

Mark Corbett: Oh man, you know that I love hockey. I, I'm not the biggest follower of it, but you can't live in Tampa without, you know, the, be a fan of the lightning and, and follow that team.

And I gotta tell you, when they won the cup and the celebrations that went with that, and the parade on the water and tossing the Stanley Cup from one boat to another, oh gosh, sacrilege. But. Luckily, and that 

Mat Germain: was football. That was Tom Brady, wasn't it? Oh, you're 

Mark Corbett: right, you're right. Jeez. Ese they all blend.

Mat Germain: You're lucky, like you've seen the, the Buccaneers win it. You've seen the lightning win it all. Uh, so you know, the rays are the last ones. I don't know if the Rowdy's have ever won a championship. I 

Mark Corbett: don't know. I don't, anyway, I, I should be, pay a little more attention. But let's face it, I'm just sunk into baseball, brother.[00:38:00] 

Um. I want to thank the, uh, folks at the Tampa Baseball Museum. They had a nice event the other night with Joe Madden there and Rick Vaughn and both signing books, a lot of fun, la and, uh, Larry Rothschild was there too. So they, that's cool. That's cool. Try to get, tell, 

Mat Germain: get a little story out of that group.

Like what, what was the, uh, the cigars being handed out or the, the wine, uh, you know, was there, was there any Joe Madden speeches on wine? 

Mark Corbett: I'm gonna have to get more from that 'cause I actually had to leave early. Uh, but yeah. Yeah, there's, there was a lot of fun. There's a lot, I've seen a lot of photos, but, uh, yeah, I'm gonna try to get Joe and certainly Larry on the show as well.

But, uh, we'll see how that comes together and let's see what else is going on, my friend. Well, that's the bulk of me. I'm trying to, I guess I better start picking up my, uh, program for the Derby here soon. I'll be coming up in May. And so still got a few weeks before that. The beyond that, I just wanna see the Rays win, brother.

I [00:39:00] just wanna see him come up. I wanna see him get strong and win. 

Mat Germain: I will say that the, the three Rays affiliates are all doing well and, and the talent's coming back. The talent is there. It's going to rise. I was watching Brody Hopkins pitch earlier tonight and uh, and he's still a little bit wild. He needs to get the walk rate down, but the, the rays like just generally speaking did a really good job of bringing in guys that are not that far off from, from the majors.

So, um, I think. It's okay to have the transition years, it's okay to, to have things happen that that kind of, you know, are good hurdles. I think I, when I look at the Rays this year, I think of the Houston Astros of last year, the Astros started really slow and, and they were like, thought of to be out of the pitcher.

Okay, don't ever, the Astros are falling because they let somebody go and he left and that was the end. And of course they all came back and. And they ended up making the playoffs. So, [00:40:00] you know, the, it's still so early in the season to be making any declarations about anything. Yeah. And uh, I think, you know, there's a good chance that road trips tend to get teams to bond a little bit, right?

The rays have not spent much time on the road, so this is their first one. We'll see if it helps the bonding process and it helps them, you know, when they get back home and, and they start jelling a little bit. And a lot of those young guys like Junior ero and uh, and Chandler Simpson and Jonathan Aranda, if they're going to be the core, put them at the top of the lineup.

See, write it out, see how it goes. And there's enough teams out there that are looking for pitching as well. So when Shane McClannahan is ready to come back. And then I think we, we saw the Joe Boyle, um, start where he almost had a no hitter. You know, like the, there's. Yeah, there's a lot to be thankful about and the Rays side of things and to look up to, you know, and say, okay, [00:41:00] we're, we're gonna find a way at some point.

It's just gonna take a little bit of time to massage, uh, the situation to get what we want out of it. I was watching the reaction of Kevin Cash the other day in one of the games. And, and you could just smell the frustration from him and see it in his face. Like he's just, every time that they have scoring opportunities are just coming up short and they can't, you know, get those final runs across the board.

And they're always closed. They're always within reach. Yeah. They just, they're not getting that killer instinct. Uh. You know, so it's not like we're the Rockies, it's not like we're a down and out franchise like the White Sox. Um, the Rays have the talent and potential to, to fight back basically. And especially when I look around and I see all the injuries.

And they see some of the issues that they, the js with their pitching depth and, and things like that. There are avenues for other teams to fall to the Rays just as much as there are for the Rays to [00:42:00] rise a little bit higher. So, eh, another month and a half, I think we'll have a much better idea of where, what kind of team to Rays are for 2025.

Mark Corbett: , . I remember a couple years ago we had a long run of wins and it's like win after win after win, and there's just going to be highs and lows out of 162 games.

So I, I, I too hope and expect to see more growth with the team as far as their achievement, and I hope you're right about 'em. Gelling on the road. There is something to be said for that, so I, I'm excited about that as well, Mat. Well, I haven't got any other nuggets. Is there anything else you wanted to tap on?

Mat Germain: No, uh, just say that Charleston RiverDogs are one of the hottest teams in a ball right now. After starting off ice cold. They won six two today. Uh, I also saw that one, uh, corner of my eye as, as I was working, but, uh, they're, uh. They're definitely one of the teams that, since they brought up Brayer Guerrero, I'll be watching a lot more [00:43:00] of, uh, and we keep looking for his name and the GREs are playing Jack lines.

He's a short stop from Canada on that team. 

Mark Corbett: Hmm. At 

Mat Germain: the top. And Nathan, Ian, I know we talked about him. He, he had his first extra base hit today, so, uh. You know, the, the younger teams are sometimes a lot of fun to watch because they're so far away that you're like, I can dream they'll become whatever I want them to become.

Oh, I love it. Have some fun with that. While the rays are going through a, a, a losing streak and, and look a little bit deeper and you might find some, some sunshine. 

Mark Corbett: There you go. Boys and girls. We always encourage you, no Mater how well the rays are doing to enjoy minor league baseball and certainly the teams that the rays have, so whether it be river dogs, whether it be, uh, bulls, who, let's see, biscuits, who am I forgetting?

The hot rods, hot rods. So plenty. Plenty of different teams to see out there. And if you got MLB network like I do, you can usually catch [00:44:00] those games there as well. So a lot of fun. A lot of fun. Well, boys and girls, that's about it for me. Mat, any final words? Nope, that's it. I keep asking if you have any more final words.

You, it's only a third time. Nah, man. Alright, well thank you Allall for joining us here today. It's always fun on baseball biz on deck, and we look forward to seeing you again real soon.